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Mlokie Group: Members Posts: 61 Joined: April 2000 Posted: May 14 2001, 20:43 Don Alfonso is a wonderful record.. (I'd love to get an original single sometimes) But there exists also a german version, which is now already available in mp3 in many places.. I still don't know anything about it. Who sang it? Who played the drums? Who did it and when (and why )? Was Mike present (I don't think so, but why it's so popular)? Some info says it comes from a '73 live. I really doubt about it because you can hear the original version (including vocals) in the background. And this single was issued in '74 or '75 with vocals of David Bedford, as I remember. Thanks for any advice.. Back to top

Mlokie Group: Members Posts: 61 Joined: April 2000 Posted: May 19 2001, 05:27 The Rainer Münz collection has a picture of a sleeve: http://www.rzuser.uni-heidelberg.de/~jk0/oldfield/pic/singles/don_d.jpg On vocals PAUL?? ... Back to top

CarstenKuss Group: Musicians Posts: 362 Joined: Nov. 1999 Posted: May 19 2001, 18:43 OK, you can get the MP3 here: http://interoz.com/raremike/ But I must give a HEALTH WARNING: This is really bad...!!! -------------- -Carsten- Back to top

Mlokie Group: Members Posts: 61 Joined: April 2000 Posted: May 20 2001, 02:24 I already own the mp3, for a long time... I just wanted to know some info (if anybody else knows), I really know what does it sound like.. But thanks anyway. Back to top

Korgscrew Group: Super Admins Posts: 3511 Joined: Dec. 1999 Posted: May 20 2001, 15:27 I think I replied somewhere else to somebody that I think this vocalist was somebody connected with Tangerine Dream. I believe one of their producers, or one of them, produced this German version. I can't say much more - I know little about Tangerine Dream, or about this version of Don Alfonso. I may have remembered something wrong, though. Back to top

CarstenKuss Group: Musicians Posts: 362 Joined: Nov. 1999 Posted: May 20 2001, 16:29 Mlokie, I know you've got it (because you described it). I just added the URL and the drastic comment to get more people into the discussion, get them interested... Because I also want to learn more... Carsten -------------- -Carsten- Back to top

CarstenKuss Group: Musicians Posts: 362 Joined: Nov. 1999 Posted: May 20 2001, 16:42 Found something: http://www.agitation-free.de/af/e11.htm The singer's name is Roland Paulick. And yes, he was with Tangerine Dream. -------------- -Carsten- Back to top

Mlokie Group: Members Posts: 61 Joined: April 2000 Posted: May 20 2001, 18:29 Great, thanks CarstenKuss! (I'm sorry, hope more people would get interrested..) This voice seemed to me like a bit older man's voice, but "Rolli" was only 26 years old at the time when he sang it! I hope that's him on the picture on the single cover. Thanks, I finally know who is it but then another question.. how did he get interrested in doing this? (I'm not sure if anybody knows an answer, but I'll never stop asking questions.. ) He met Mike? (the single was released by Virgin) Back to top

CarstenKuss Group: Musicians Posts: 362 Joined: Nov. 1999 Posted: May 21 2001, 16:37 Found something else: Tangerine Dream were on tour in the UK in October 1975. See here: http://users.tinyonline.co.uk/ian.simpson/ian.simpson/tangerine%20dream%201975%20tour .htm On that tour, 'Rolli' was with the road crew. Or, as another source says: He was a drunken roadie. See here: http://members.tripod.de/distantearth/know/knowing.htm My personal theory: Since the tour manager was Andrew Graham Stewart of Virgin, Mike might have got a backstage pass. He met the TD people backstage, invited them after show to his studio, where Roland recorded the vocal track right away, with lots of 'liquid friends'...TD Producer Edgar Froese might also have been present, doing some 'producing' (=fiddling with the faders). Then Mike (or AGS) talked Virgin into publishing that cr**... THE MYSTERY DEEPENS... Any ideas??? -------------- -Carsten- Back to top

dgcaer Group: Members Posts: 72 Joined: Dec. 2000 Posted: May 22 2001, 10:25 I have more info about that. You know that the music of the film Exorcist is by Mike Oldfield. It's a film by William Friedkin. At the releasing of the film M. Friedkin met Tangerine Dream, which he ask Tangerine Dream for doing the next soundtrack: Sorcerer. (A very good soundtrack by the way). He said in the booklet of the soudtrack: "I first heard the Tangerine Dream while in Munich for the opening of The Exorcist. Had I heard them sooner I would have asked them to score that film. etc." Is it possible that Mike Oldfield and Tangerine Dream met at this moment at Munich, and have the idea of doing music together, which they did later when they toured in England with Roland Paulick as roadie crew ? Back to top

Mlokie Group: Members Posts: 61 Joined: April 2000 Posted: May 23 2001, 15:12 Yes, it sounds 'liquid friendly'.. Your theory, Carsten, seems quite real.. I think it could be so. But maybe it was mainly Stewart's work, he could own a copy of Don Alfonso and while playing it, 'liquid friendies' caused Rolli sing it in german. Or maybe they took it seriously.. Then just decided to record it. That's my version.. By the way, Assaad Debs was also manager and promoter for TD and did "all other acts under contract to Virgin Records". Does this mean that TD was signed to Virgin? And then somebody had to play those simple drums. Maybe it was Christoph Franke from TD (he was a member in 1971-1987). But I'm still wondering who and how convinced Virgin to release it.. Back to top

Mlokie Group: Members Posts: 61 Joined: April 2000 Posted: May 23 2001, 15:29 ..oh yes, there were 4 UK albums with Virgin.. Shame I haven't very good inet possibilities anymore, so I could browse it some more and more often.. And: "Few new bands have received such a bad press as Tangerine Dream when they began to be heard in Britain. Steve Lake, apotheosis of the avant garde, wrote them off as Muzak. The same critics who had saved their most vitriolic epithets till then for slagging off Mike Oldfield turned on the Dreamers with the same adjectival aggro: somnolence, cures for insomnia, amorphousness, perm any one of three charges." (taken from 'TD 1975 UK Tourbook' page) ...? Back to top

CarstenKuss Group: Musicians Posts: 362 Joined: Nov. 1999 Posted: May 23 2001, 17:23 'He could own a copy'??? To make a German version back in 1975, he would have needed 1) The original multitrack tape or 2) A master tape without the English vocals. Mlokie, do you really think that Virgin send such a thing to Germany, saying 'Use it as you like'? I don't think so. That recording must have been made in Mike's studio, onto the original multitrack. Are there really different drums in the German version? Or is it just a remix of the original drums? -------------- -Carsten- Back to top

dgcaer Group: Members Posts: 72 Joined: Dec. 2000 Posted: May 24 2001, 10:13 Why does people talk about thing that they doesn't know. I always see bad opinion and mistake about Tangerine Dream in this forum. It's a shame. Tangerine Dream has signed a contract of 10 years with Virgin in summer 1973. They did 9 album, 2 live album and 1 soundtrack with Virgin between 1973 and 1983. Also Tangerine Dream had recorded the 2 first album with Virgin at The Manor. Phaedra in december 73 and Rubycon in January 1975. It's almost impossible that Mike Oldfield and Tangerine Dream haven't met in this time. Also, TD was with Klaus Schulze too, probably the only Germans with Virgin and the most know. It's truly possible that he ask them for a German vocal performance. It's just for make some correction. Back to top

dgcaer Group: Members Posts: 72 Joined: Dec. 2000 Posted: May 24 2001, 15:57 I seen that Roland Paulick was also the technical assistant at THE MANOR when TD recorded Rubycon in January 1975. Mike Oldfield could also met Roland Paulick in January 1975. Then, the recording of Don Alfonso (german version), was in January or in autumn 1975. One thing sure is that Roland Paulick was the singer and Edgar Froese (Leader of TD) was the producer. It was probably done before the recording of In Dulci Jubilo (2nd version) because the track In Dulci Jubilo (For Maureen) is include with Don Alfonso (German) in the single. We know that Mike rerecorded IDJ(2nd version) later because the sound wasn't really good. Back to top

CarstenKuss Group: Musicians Posts: 362 Joined: Nov. 1999 Posted: May 24 2001, 20:01 OK. January or October 1975? Maybe we can find out if we reconstruct which studio was used. In October 1975, Mike's Studio was no more The Manor. It was The Beacon. Because Ommadawn was recorded there in September. All of Mike's equipment had been moved there, so he surely wasn't working at The Manor any more. OK? Here is a proof that the original Don Alfonso must have been recorded in February or earlier: http://www.carmay.com/recordcollector4_90.htm So, to prove that DAG was recorded in January, we must prove the following: 1) Mike was still working at The Manor in January. There he met Tangerine Dream. 2) The original Don Alfonso was recorded at The Manor in January, or earlier. So they could use it to do overdubs. 3) DAG was recorded BEFORE the release of the English version. But was released AFTERWARDS. Unlikely, eh? To prove that DAG was recorded in October, we have to prove the following: Roland Paulick (+ Edgar Froese) were at The Beacon and recorded music. Even though Tangerine Dream were not in studio, but on tour. Unlikely, eh? THE MYSTERY DEEPENS STILL... What about the 'simple drums'? - I think they could have been played by anyone -------------- -Carsten- Back to top

dgcaer Group: Members Posts: 72 Joined: Dec. 2000 Posted: May 25 2001, 10:28 Mike Oldfield, was again recording at the Manor in October 1975, because he recorded In Dulci Jubilo(Second Version) there in October 1975. However he recorded In Dulci Jubilo (For Maureen) at the Beacon studio in November 1974. I think that he was using the two studio. As we see on the single there is 2 tracks: -Don Alfonso (German) -In Dulci Jubilo (For Maureen) 1- IDJ (For Maureen) was recorded in November 1974 at the Beacon 2- Don Alfonso (English) was recorded before february 1975 (maybe end of 1974) we doesn't know where. It was released in february 1975 if I remember well. 3- IDJ (2nd Version) was recorded in October 1975 at the Manor 4- Don Alfonso (German) was recorded surely after Don Alfonso (English) and surely before IDJ (2nd version) because it wasn't this version on the single. I think also that it was recorded not long after Don Alfonso (English) because this single follow the other with the tracks Don Alfonso(English)and In Dulci Jubilo(For Maureen). It's why I think Don Alfonso was recorded in January 1975 at The Manor with the voice of Roland Paulick and Edgar Froese as the producer. Mike Oldfield was probably there but didn't do anything because the music was already recorded. Maybe the Drum can have been remake by Christopher Franke (from TD). He has played drum many years. To confirm that, I want to know when was released the 2 Don Alfonso singles, English and German. It may give a clue. Back to top

Korgscrew Group: Super Admins Posts: 3511 Joined: Dec. 1999 Posted: May 25 2001, 17:15 Just a little more on The Manor - the african drums for Ommadawn were also recorded there. Mike also did parts of Platinum there, so he was still around there for a while... To avoid any confusion that might arise, I'll just add that The Manor was never "Mike's studio" in the sense of being his own - he just worked (and lived) there for a while. Back to top

CarstenKuss Group: Musicians Posts: 362 Joined: Nov. 1999 Posted: May 25 2001, 18:53 I gave incomplete information: Ommadawn was recorded at The Beacon JANUARY - September 1975. Not only September. This is stated on the vinyl's inner sleeve. According to Korgscrew (who is usually right ) ,this information is also incomplete. Some bits of Ommadawn were recorded at The Manor! Also, according to dgcaer, IDJ was recorded FIRST at The Beacon and THEN at The Manor. OK. It seems sure that Mike went to and fro between the two studios in 1975. So there isn't such a thing as 'His Studio'. I must apologise. I think we have only one chance to solve this: If DAG was released BEFORE October, then it must have been recorded in January at The Manor. I'll try to contact Rainer Münz. -------------- -Carsten- Back to top

dgcaer Group: Members Posts: 72 Joined: Dec. 2000 Posted: May 28 2001, 10:14 The percussion section on the DAG have been rerecorded. It's very different and it's not the kind of percussion we habitually ear with Mike Oldfield at this era. It's a drum. Maybe as I said some messages earlier, it can be recorded by Chris Franke(from TD) who has been a drummer for many year. Back to top

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