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Topic: Procol Harum, All aboard!< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
Major Gowen Offline




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Posted: Jan. 13 2009, 21:08

Any Procol Harum fans on here? I got into them about ten years ago, basically taking a punt on A Salty Dog. I wasn’t sure what to expect, obviously A Whiter Shade Of Pale is incredibly famous, and they'd been lumbered with this 'classical rock' reputation. But I thought A Salty Dog was a great album, and showcased a band that seemed to be pulling in different directions, classical/orchestral rock one way, and heavy blues rock the other. What also stood out was the lyrics, which could be surreal and at other times incredibly personal. And then there’s Gary Brooker’s voice, I always felt he was the best of the British blues/R&B singers. Plus drummer BJ Wilson, who definitely had a touch of Keith Moon about him.

I think their best period was the first four albums, when Robin Trower was in the band. He leant them a harder edge, particularly on Home, which is one of the great lost albums of British 70s rock, a very dark, almost disturbing listening experience, almost every track seems to concern death in some way. Once he left I don’t think they were consistently as good, although they were still capable of some genius moments, such as Grand Hotel.

Of course the band’s name recently seems to have become a byword for litigation and court cases over the songwriting credits on A Whiter Shade Of Pale, but I think they’re a band who deserve a bit more recognition.
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larstangmark Offline




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Posted: Jan. 14 2009, 04:30

I've never heard a single song except form "White shade...". Now I'm curious! Is "Home" the place to start?
Seeing salty dog in a record store I can't say the cover art indicates a work of genius, but Incantataions doesn't look too good either.


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"There are twelve people in the world, the rest are paste"
Mark E Smith
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Major Gowen Offline




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Posted: Jan. 15 2009, 13:34

Quote (larstangmark @ Jan. 14 2009, 04:30)
I've never heard a single song except form "White shade...". Now I'm curious! Is "Home" the place to start?
Seeing salty dog in a record store I can't say the cover art indicates a work of genius, but Incantataions doesn't look too good either.

Probably A Salty Dog is the best place to start, it has all the classic Procol elements in place and the title track is their best song. Home is a brilliant album and I can't recommend it enough, but be prepared for some utter bleakness! Supposedly John Peel didn't want to play the track Dead Man's Dream as he deemed it too disturbing. Having said that I was listening to Grand Hotel the other day and think it's their most lavish and expansive album, such an attention to detail in the arrangements.
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Bassman Offline




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Posted: Jan. 19 2009, 15:19

It's funny how just the other day I was listening to "Conquistador (Live)" in the car.  The drumming on that just rocks.  Sometimes there's simply nothing like a drummer wailing away at the kit with an orchestra going full tilt behind him.

I don't have much of their stuff... a 2-CD best of and the box set of their A and B sides (and some old vinyl that I never dig out).  But I enjoy them a lot and it's just a damn shame that they are so often maligned by prog detractors.

I've been on a big Triumvirat kick lately.  Maybe my next overdose will be Procol.  I sort of tend to do that... listen to nothing but one band for weeks, then grab something else and do the same thing.
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Dirk Star Offline




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Posted: Aug. 03 2009, 08:42

Quote (Major Gowen @ Jan. 14 2009, 02:08)

Quote
Of course the band’s name recently seems to have become a byword for litigation and court cases over the songwriting credits on A Whiter Shade Of Pale,


A few months ago Captain Sensible wrote the following blog below in relation to that "litigation".You might say that there have been a few developments since then..

2008....

He turned 'A Whiter Shade Of Pale'

It is with dismay that I read the other day that my old chum Matthew Fisher, former organist of prog rockers Procul Harum has lost his claim for a share of the royalties on 'A Whiter Shade Of Pale' from the bands singer Gary Brooker at the Court Of Appeal in London.

When I started my solo 'pop' career in the 80s it was Matthew's studio, just up the road from my humble abode in Croydon that I commenced recording in, striking up a great working relationship with the virtuosic one from the word go. I found we had 2 important things in common - first he was a bit.... well, weird and wonderful I suppose sums him up. And second, and more importantly we both liked a beer... or twelve.

And it would be during the odd recreational break in the proceedings that his discontent with the publishing situation over THAT SONG would occasionally rear it's ugly head. I wouldn't exactly say he was bitter, more hurt that his former colleague would not consent to his name being added to the song-writing credits - for anyone who has heard this song (is there anyone who hasn't I wonder?) would have to agree that it is Fisher's beautiful flowing Hammond Organ lines that have made the tune so phenomenally successful over the years.... and not the somewhat forgettable original song with it's mumbo jumbo, druggy sounding lyrics about nothing much in particular.

Now everyone who has ever been in a band knows how thorny a subject publishing credits can become, and indeed Brooker fought tooth and nail throughout the long and costly trial (£500,000... kerching, another nice fat payday for the bloke in the wig) to persuade the court that it was solely HIS genius as a tunesmith that had propelled the hit single into music history - but I have to say I don't have the titles of any of his other pop sensations on the tip of my tongue.... do you?

No, for me the swirling Hammond IS the song, in fact if you ask the man in the street how the tune goes they will instantly sing you the organ line, and not the old waffle about dancing 'fandangos' with 'vestal virgins'. Which really ought to be 'case proven M'lud'  - but unfortunately Lord Justice Mummery (a right groover no doubt) decided that even though Matthew's name has now been rightfully included as a songwriter he would leave the royalty situation as it was when the record was released in 1967 - a bizarre anomaly I think you'll agree. And with the record having been a staple of classic hits radio the World over ever since then you can imagine that the sums of money we are talking about here are pretty colossal.

But lawyers say some funny stuff to back up their cases don't they? Brooker's were coming out with stuff like "well, if you judge in favour of Mr Fisher in THIS case then every session musician who ever played on a bestseller would be thumbing through the Yellow Pages to find a legal team to sue for a share of the publishing of THAT record".... a scenario that would of course cause chaos in 'showbiz' circles - but commence the popping of champaign corks over at the chambers of Messrs Sue, Grabbit and Runne.

But I'm not sure there's TOO much likelihood that all those former school-kid singers on 'Another Brick In The Wall' will be demanding their share of Roger Water's earnings because, going back to the song in question - I believe 'A Whiter Shade Of Pale' to be a utterly unique case as the organ melody does more than embellish the piece, it raises and enhances the song out of all recognition to what it must have been before and I reckon my mate Matthew should be given his long overdue slice of the not inconsiderable cake forthwith!

The fact that the fabulously melodic organ lines in question DO also owe more than the odd nod to the works of Johan Sebastian Bach is neither here or there as he is no longer around these days to stake a claim for HIS cut of the proceeds.... ahem.

Pip pip - Captain S


JULY 2009..........

Hi Everyone

Just in case you hadn't heard the news, the House of Lords have reversed the strange ruling of Lord Justice Mummery (in the Court of Appeal), who seemed
to be unaware that there is no statute of limitations on intellectual
property.

As a result my copyright in  A Whiter Shade of Pale  is now alive and well, and should be
earning me a modest pension for the foreseeable future.

I thank you all for your support and encouragement.

Best wishes - Maf



To be perfectley honest I can`t say I agree with Sensible on this one,and imo the "justice system" may well have opened up the floodgates here.What I will say in defence of Cap though is at least he practises what he preaches.In that his own compositions for The Damned are nearly always "copyrighted" to every member of the band at the time.That said you have to wonder where this kind of decision may lead us to?

What if George Harrison had borne a grudge for instance for "giving away" some of his guitar riffs to some Lennon & McCartney compostions?Or also just thinking about some of the Pink Floyd/Roger Waters songs I guess,a number of which Waters is supposedly not even playing on at all.I mean obviously in comparison all those guys were very well off,and probably the thought of "unfair royalties" or whatever never entered their heads anyway.For the maybe not so wealthy though?Or for those people sat there slightly bitter about it all down on Wasted Heroin Chic Trailer Park?..Well yeah we`re possibly looking at a powder-keg goldmine here waiting to go off.Can`t say I`ve heard much about Spandau Ballet since they reportadly buried all their differneces and got back together.Just who really owns the rights to all those wonderful trousers they used to wear?
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Major Gowen Offline




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Posted: Aug. 05 2009, 23:06

Well it's quite ironic that the organ riff in question, which is at the heart of the whole sorry affair, is actually lifted from someone else's work. Supposedly a gentleman's agreement was made about who should or shouldn't receive songwriting credits for AWSOP on a train journey back in around 1967, whether that's true who knows - if it is true it says a lot about how much the music industry has changed over the years. In the heady days of the 60s it was a handshake on a train, in the corporate 21st century it's lawyers and court cases. I think this was Gary Brooker's argument - why didn't Matthew Fisher pipe up at the time, instead of leaving it for years and years whilst the song became so popular. I could have my facts wrong though. The thing is this cements AWSOP's position as Procol Harum's sole contribution to popular music in the eyes of most people, which is of eternal sadness to yours truly, who regards 'A Salty Dog' as being worth a hundred 'Whiter Shade Of Pale's.

Although I now have a nice mental image of the Captain getting trolleyed with the ex-Procol organist though!
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Scatterplot Offline




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Posted: Aug. 06 2009, 05:11

Procol Harum was a good band. Weak reply, but honest in it's intent.
Jimbo


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We raise our voices in the night
Crying to heaven
And will our voices be heard
Or will they break Like the wind
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