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Topic: SG advice, Please help!< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
Robert Offline




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Posted: July 17 2003, 16:31

Hi there!

Ive been thinking of getting an SG, as Im keen to get the Ommadawn sound but also cos I think they are great anyway! The Epiphone models are at very student friendly prices but they do a few models. Does anyone have any advice or tips about these guitars?

Thanks!
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Korgscrew Offline




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Posted: July 18 2003, 01:34

The SG guitars which Mike Oldfield used were P90 equipped Les Paul/SG Juniors.
Epiphone used to make a similar model, though it was right at the bottom end of their range, and so I can imagine that it may not have been the most inspiring guitar to play. Counting against it most was its bolt on neck - the Gibson version has a glued in neck, which tends to give a guitar more of a smooth sustaining sound (at least, this is how they're perceived - the reality could be a little more complex, and depends on the transmission of vibrations across the joint, but let's not go there!). I would actually have recommended having a look at their Les Paul Special double cutaway, which had a glued in neck and two P90 pickups, and all for a very reasonable price, but judging by their website, it appears that they don't make that model any longer.

Likewise Gibson were, last year, making an SG junior model which was quite reasonably priced, but they too appear to have been discontinued.

If you really want a guitar of that kind with a P90 pickup, you could have a look at a Gordon Smith SG1 with the optional P90 pickup. They are very well made guitars (hand built in the UK) and the prices are very reasonable (that particular combination would cost you £450). You could alternatively have a look at their GS1 model, which you could get in a double cutaway shape with P90 pickup, which might prove a tiny bit less expensive.
The price of them is more than the Epiphones, but the quality is up there with Gibson (though Gordon Smiths tend to be less fancy looking).


Not too long ago, second hand SG Juniors used to be available for not too much money. Prices of them have gone through the roof in the past ten years or so though, making them ones more for the serious vintage enthusiast rather than musicians looking for an honest, value for money working tool (for the price of an old SG junior now, it would be possible to commission a luthier to build a unique guitar to your own specifications...or indeed an SG Junior replica for less than the price of a real old one, and probably just as good sounding...well...you pays your money and you takes your choice, as they say)


Mike has used many guitars with humbucking pickups, though - Epiphone's G400 SG Standard replica would give you all of those sounds (as used on much of Incantations, for example, not to mention his more recent work), plus the advantages of the SG shape (great high fret access). I'd imagine you could get something very similar to the Ommadawn sound from one if you worked at it.

My advice with guitars like Epiphones is that the quality control is not likely to be the most wonderful (though some say that about Gibson too...), so it's probably worth looking round to find a good one.
They seem to be quite reasonable guitars, though. A friend of mine who wanted to take up the electric guitar bought an Epiphone Special II (a Les Paul shaped thing with a slab body and bolt on neck) - a very basic guitar, but it seemed quite decent, especially considering how cheap it was.

There are of course various options from other brands. When buying far eastern guitars, it's not always worth paying much attention to the brand name which is on it, as a huge number of them come from the same factories (the main one would be Samick in Korea, who make a staggering number of guitars - I forget the exact figure, but they make somewhere between 60 and 80 percent of all guitars sold in the world). Some of the decision depends on whether you mind buying un-licensed copies, of course.
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Mike Chadwick Offline




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Posted: July 18 2003, 04:48

Anyway, if you can't fing SG junior guitar (With p-90 pickup) i can tell you that Epiphone Les paul JUnior sounds simmilar.I was playing on ot few months and it has great sustain and tone. If you have digitech multieffect or even equaliser you will sound Like Mike - of course if you can play like mike (-;
The only bad thing about Epiphone's les paul junior's id that that quality of equipment is poor - keys,Bridge and controls are not the best type...i sugest replacing it.


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Robert Offline




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Posted: July 18 2003, 06:19

Thanks for the replies!

I play a Fender Standard Strat, and always thought of the Les Pauls and SGs to be heavy, punky instruments that many horrible rock bands used, as I thought the humbucking pups gave a very meaty sound. But after seeing Mike I realised they gave sweet tones aswell.

Is this down to his P90 pick up, or will a humbucker SG sound similar?
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Mike Chadwick Offline




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Posted: July 18 2003, 11:21

In his Sg jr. and Les paul jr. he had P-90 pickup so this made this great sound from his eighties and earlier records, but remember that he used Les paul standard and standard humbucker guitars (PRS guitars) as well - it mostly depends what amp and efects you are using and how good you are playing.

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Korgscrew Offline




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Posted: July 18 2003, 16:15

Indeed. The P90 pickups do have a lighter sound than humbuckers (a lot of people find them less 'muddy' than a humbucker, a little clearer sounding, but still meatier than a Fender style single coil). A SG with humbuckers will still be capable of sweet tones, though of course not identical to those from a P90.
An advantage with humbuckers of course, is that they can be coil-tapped to give single coil sounds too (though on an Epiphone you may have to replace the pickups to be able to achieve that, as they'll most likely just have two-conductor wiring...Gordon Smiths come with coil taps as standard, but I think I'm starting to sound like an advert!). Mike very often uses one of the spilt coil sounds from his PRS - it seems to be his favourite for both distorted and clean parts.
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Robert Offline




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Posted: July 19 2003, 16:34

Thanks guys!

So, what do you recomend - Les Paul or SG?
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Robert Offline




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Posted: July 19 2003, 16:50

Or, I could get a 335 Dot, a guitar ive always liked the look of but probably wont give me a Mike - like sound.

Im confusing myself now!!!
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Korgscrew Offline




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Posted: July 20 2003, 00:23

If it was me buying, I'd be concerned about high fret access - the SG, 335 and double cutaway Les Pauls are all good in that department, while the single cutaway Les Pauls aren't so good.

Mike has used an ES335 in the past (he bought it when recording TB2), though it's since been replaced by his PRS McCarty Thinline. They have a reputation for being versatile guitars, so I don't think a 335 would be a bad choice.
I think the secret to sounding like Mike is mostly in the playing, as is the secret to sounding like yourself...
I actually say pick what you like, and don't worry about Mike :)
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Robert Offline




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Posted: July 20 2003, 06:14

I think you're probably right. The only problem is I love them all! But its a nice problem to have!

Thanks for your help Korgscrew
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Mike Chadwick Offline




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Posted: July 20 2003, 12:32

I would recomend both of them (sg and les paul).
If not buy SG - they have cool look and cool sound as well.
if not...CHOOSE A VINTAGE FENDER BASS GUITAR!!! (-;


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emac Offline




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Posted: July 21 2003, 08:43

A word on Sgs
            The early sg will have a rip roaring resonant responsive sound. particuarly from the early half of the 60s this is due largely to the type of neck joint used and the light mahagony body. More recent ones sound well, kind of murky and dead. I have owned a few gibsons but the one i've kept is the early sg. it simply has a life of it's own.
   If you want that sound on a budget I think the light mahagony is the most important part followed closely by the neck joint.
   Lets not forget the pickup. The P90 really has that wonderful warmth and clarity but beware, they are very very noisy.
   If you are using a tele type, roll the tone back a bit
   if you are using a strat wire it so there is tone control on the treble pickup, and then roll it back a bit.
But as it has been said in the past, Its all in the fingers!
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