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Guest Unregistered Posted: June 04 2009, 16:36 26 years after I bought my first cd, CRISES...I have decided to learn how to play guitar (it´s YOUR damn fault, Mike Oldfield   ).. And even though I "blame" MO for making me want to play, I am pretty certain that I won´t start with his music -mainly because I think it is to technical or because many of his lovely pieces of music have the same repetitive accords which I suspect very soon will drive my arm/fingers totally numb.. SO... I could use some advise from the hardliners in here.. I really hate heavy metal, so I won´t go for electric (right now anyway) but I´m more into buying a classical/Spanish guitar -a cheap one - no sense to buy expensive if it turns out that I´m a moron with 5 thumps on every hand... I like more ordinary rock/pop - Beatles, Sting, Dire Straits and such & of course Oldfield, whom I haven't gotten a category for.. How important is the length of the guitars neck? Size of the guitars body? Should I start to learn to play with a pick, fingertips or nails? Strings...nylon/metal/whiskers from my cat? I am left handed, is there something special I need to consider because of that? Any good ideas or considerations are welcome   Back to top

Scatterplot Group: Members Posts: 1981 Joined: Dec. 2007 Posted: June 04 2009, 19:56 I sure hope I intercepted you in time. Your use of the word "spanish" guitar. Does that imply nylon stringed guitar? If so, no. I thought the same thing around 1980 when a freind(a pretty good acoustic player too) led me in the right direction. Steel 6 string. His reply to my query about starting with a nylon was "No. It may be more painful Jim, but in the end this is the way to start."     I don't know if you live in the US, but musiciansfreind.com is a great place to at least research guitars. Some have bought over the I-net, but you want to go "feel" the thing before you buy it. Unless you just want to try a $100 dreadnought style git(but might break easy and not stay in tune). Epiphone is a good bet. Don't buy the cheapest one, but if your not sure you will really like guitar don't spend $1000. Try for the $200 range. You asked about picking/strumming. Yes with a steel six string you will want some picks. Jim Dunlop nylon picks. There are about 5 or 6 thicknesses. Get a pack of the "next to the lowest" thickness. If they sell the picks individually get 2 each of several thicknesses. But a new set of strings. Ask the dealer for a decent brand of phoshor bronze light guage strings. Put those in a drawer until you learn to tune your git, learn a few chords, then tackle re-stringing it. Many of us here can talk you thru that. If you've got the cash, spring for a guitar cleaning cloth, polishing spray, and a decent brand of "fret ease" spray to lubricate the strings and ease your fingers. If they've got cheap "gig bags" see if they will throw in one for free. If your dog nuts rich get a hard guitar case. Guitars do not like changes in temperature or humidity and will stay in tune better if stored this way. You can get a beginner's book, but there are so many free lessons and forums on the net. Try going to zentao.com stonedragon's guitar forum. Last time I looked them up they were still online. Good lessons there. Thats about it, steel string! I don't know if you have a big belly, but the round Ovation types of guitars don't go well with bellys. A bit pricey too. Good luck and have fun. Remember, there will be some pain untill you get callouses. But that's guitar. Goes with the territory. After you learn the first 5 "campfire chords" you can sort of learn some MO-no kidding. Jim -------------- We raise our voices in the night Crying to heaven And will our voices be heard Or will they break Like the wind Back to top

Scatterplot Group: Members Posts: 1981 Joined: Dec. 2007 Posted: June 04 2009, 20:01 Oops, missed the lefty thing. Yes you can buy lefty guitars. Should not pose a problem. Jim -------------- We raise our voices in the night Crying to heaven And will our voices be heard Or will they break Like the wind Back to top

Scatterplot Group: Members Posts: 1981 Joined: Dec. 2007 Posted: June 04 2009, 20:08 Oops I must be gettin' old or just like being over 1000 posts now. You like Beatles? Best way to start. Tons of easy song lessons out there that begin with Beatles tunes. I'm done now.....I just love guitar. -------------- We raise our voices in the night Crying to heaven And will our voices be heard Or will they break Like the wind Back to top

ex member 419 Group: Members Posts: 1177 Joined: April 2008 Posted: June 05 2009, 04:03 Yo jim good advice my friend, i prefer ibanez classical, nylon strings, no pick, fingerpicking mo style, slim, long neck, not rounded, started on a leftie! easy as! prepare for bleeding bruised fingers once you play fast! do get fret ease, have fun! deb Back to top

The Caveman Group: Members Posts: 2178 Joined: Jan. 2008 Posted: June 05 2009, 06:55 Really it's down to personal taste.I would say go for a steel strung guitar though.Like Jim i would recommend Epiphone but anything over £100 should be reasonable.Ther are several different body sizes around from dinky little parlour size guitars,through folk models to big old dreadnoughts.I use a dreadnought as it's a good all round style for finger and pick styles and it's quite loud.But try a few a see what you prefer.  Most brands do a left handed range but you may pay slightly more for it.To pick with fingers or to pick with a pick?Depends on what you want to play.Mike's preferred style is with the fingers as we know and so is Mark Knopfler from Dire Straits but the Beatles used mainly picks (with notable exceptions ie Julia and Blackbird) as do most players in that style.If you can learn both that would be a massive bonus. It'll hurt for a while but persavere. Above all enjoy it.THE most important part. -------------- THE COMING OF THE GREAT WHITE HANDKERCHEIF IS NIGH. Back to top

The Caveman Group: Members Posts: 2178 Joined: Jan. 2008 Posted: June 05 2009, 08:32 @Deb.What's fret ease?Is that like Fast Frets?Never used the stuff cos it gunks up the finger board after a bit i find.But then if you use a good quality finger board oil every restring it should clean it out along with all the muck and sweat that even the cleanest fingers leave in there. -------------- THE COMING OF THE GREAT WHITE HANDKERCHEIF IS NIGH. Back to top

The Caveman Group: Members Posts: 2178 Joined: Jan. 2008 Posted: June 05 2009, 08:45 BTW on the subject learning to play Oldfield peices as a novice player.Some of it really is really really hard (i won't even attempt a lot of it.The really fast stuff scares the poop out of me)and will guarentee RSI.However the good new is some of it is really quite easy.For example Jungle Gardenia is a nice simple little tune as is Molly (except for toward the end where is gets a little trickier but nothing too bad).Portsmouth is a doddle to play rhythm to if you learn C,F and G.And although it sounds like hard work the beginning of Incantations Part 3 isn't all that difficult although you may needs to shift it down an octave as it's played way up the neck and the beginning of part 4 is fairly easy. After a few months with either a decent teacher or a book you should be able to start picking bits up. Don't restrict yourself to trying to learn guitar melodies either.All insruments have the same notes so if you want to learn a part played on piano try it (i can think of one hugely obvious one that's ridiculously easy to play on guitar). -------------- THE COMING OF THE GREAT WHITE HANDKERCHEIF IS NIGH. Back to top

Inkanta Group: Admins Posts: 1453 Joined: Feb. 2000 Posted: June 05 2009, 08:58 prisoner...Re: the left-handed aspect....I am left-handed, as well. Don't assume that you'll need to do anything differently because of your handedness.  I have had guitars since age 12 but never a left-handed one (or one strung for lefties--whatever adjustments some make). Not sure what I would have done if presented with a left-handed guitar--it would probably have been as disastrous as the left-handed scissors. Just couldn't cut with 'em. (-: I suppose you could try both and see what feels more comfortable for you. -------------- "No such thing as destiny; only choices exist." From:  Moongarden's "Solaris." Back to top

The Caveman Group: Members Posts: 2178 Joined: Jan. 2008 Posted: June 05 2009, 09:03 Interesting point.For the record Hendrix (probably the best known 'left handed' player) wasn't left handed although he played left handed.In all other things he was right handed.He just happened to find it easier to play left handed. -------------- THE COMING OF THE GREAT WHITE HANDKERCHEIF IS NIGH. Back to top

Matt Group: Admins Posts: 1186 Joined: Nov. 2002 Posted: June 05 2009, 10:36 I am not a particularly good guitarist but do love playing my own guitars so I'll comment as a fellow novice of sorts: Be careful how cheap you go. Really cheap guitars can sounds pretty bad if you don't choose carefully which will put you off playing and learrning them. Suggest you take the advice of the more expert tubular.net folks on this and also try the guitars out in the shop to see if you like the sound of them. I know this might feel embarassing when other people in the shop are playing expertly and you might be struggling to do a single chord but I think it is important you like the sound of the guitar - even if it is the sound a single note makes! I also used to have a really cheap steel stringed that was *impossible* to tune. However carefully it was set up some chords were never right (I think the fret spacing might have been duff). This put me off playing it for years until I got a better one. If you find the right shop you can hopefully get an assistant to play the guitar for you and see how nice you think it can sound in the hands of an expert. I like my nylon-stringed for the sort of playing you describe but others views might be different. If you want to use your cat instead of nylon or steel, it isn't the whiskers you need. Strings are made from Catgut   Before you slice open your cat however, note that catgut strings aren't usually made from cat intestines! Good luck finding your guitar! -------------- "I say I say I say I say, what's got three bottles and five eyes and no legs and two wheels" Back to top

The Caveman Group: Members Posts: 2178 Joined: Jan. 2008 Posted: June 05 2009, 10:56 Same stuff used for violin srings i think.But the sound of one being played by a beginner sounds very like a cat having it's innards extracted!  Are you UK based prisoner?If so you could do a lot worse than the Vintage brand.Great guitars for not a vast amount of money. -------------- THE COMING OF THE GREAT WHITE HANDKERCHEIF IS NIGH. Back to top

Scatterplot Group: Members Posts: 1981 Joined: Dec. 2007 Posted: June 05 2009, 16:38 There is another fairly inexpensive alternative. Get a Fender Squier Affinity strat for about $179. Hey, played clean, its fun if you want to play the Beatles, plus you have the option of adding FX. And it's a little easier to play IMO than a dreadnought style steel acoustic. I have seen for about $250 a "strat pack", a box with a Squier Affinity strat, a little 10 or 15 watt amp, picks, a strap, a book, maybe a dvd. The amp, I've read in reviews is "ok", nothing to write home about, but it would be good for ya for a while. Something to ponder before you spend. I don't think your fingers will hurt quite as bad. Unless you buy an acoustic with pickup(s) already in it, you've already got yours electrified. Buying something like a Dean Markley pro mag to electrify an acoustic  guitar will set you back around $70. -------------- We raise our voices in the night Crying to heaven And will our voices be heard Or will they break Like the wind Back to top

Guest Unregistered Posted: June 05 2009, 17:08 Hi guys and girls, many good advises and thanks for that. You have given me good inspiration, and I know of course, that a personal adjustment of preferences is needed. Size of guitar, how comfortable is it to sit with and such can only be determent with trying it out. For now I have settled to start with nylon strings - mainly because I believe that they are softer to my fingers, and yep, I will try using fingertips for starters. The guitar itself, don't have to be designed for at lefty, but I will certainly make sure that I can play it with my lefthand... I´m a 99% lefthanded moron -  meaning that I only use my right hand for holding the toilet seat up or for support on the wall to avoid falling after a happy night out     My planned budget is about 500$ and I start looking tomorrow.. Back to top

Guest Unregistered Posted: June 05 2009, 17:20 Quote (Inkanta @ June 05 2009, 14:58) prisoner...Re: the left-handed aspect....I am left-handed, as well. Don't assume that you'll need to do anything differently because of your handedness.  I have had guitars since age 12 but never a left-handed one (or one strung for lefties--whatever adjustments some make). Not sure what I would have done if presented with a left-handed guitar--it would probably have been as disastrous as the left-handed scissors. Just couldn't cut with 'em. (-: I suppose you could try both and see what feels more comfortable for you. I´m not quite sure what you mean here.. so you play guitar as "normal" folks do, using your left hand for "the neck"? I can´t do that....I´m solely a left handed moron....I was 25 before I even recognized that I had a right arm too   Back to top

Guest Unregistered Posted: June 05 2009, 17:25 Quote (The Caveman @ June 05 2009, 16:56) Same stuff used for violin srings i think.But the sound of one being played by a beginner sounds very like a cat having it's innards extracted!  Are you UK based prisoner?If so you could do a lot worse than the Vintage brand.Great guitars for not a vast amount of money. No no no no...I come from silly little Denmark - you know...famous for vikings, beer and Lego (in that order) I don´t even know what brands of musical instruments we have here....actually I´m amazed that we have electricity   Back to top

Dirk Star Group: Members Posts: 1331 Joined: Sep. 2007 Posted: June 05 2009, 21:04 Yeah another leftie here,who also plays right handed.I`m pretty damn terrible at it though so maybe I should`ve changed years ago.I`m more of a drummer though anyway which I must admit I`ve always set-up left handed so there you go.The trouble is I kind of do both though,just depending on how I pick things up Playing cricket for instance I used to bowl left handed and bat right handed.And then I remember someone giving me a pair of left handed scissors once,and I could`nt bloody use them at all I`d become so used to using my right hand.I guess if you`re 99% left handed though Prisoner,then that`s probably the best way to go imo. Back to top

Inkanta Group: Admins Posts: 1453 Joined: Feb. 2000 Posted: June 05 2009, 21:14 Quote (prisoner.of.the.dark.sky @ June 05 2009, 17:20) I´m not quite sure what you mean here.. so you play guitar as "normal" folks do, using your left hand for "the neck"? I can´t do that....I´m solely a left handed moron....I was 25 before I even recognized that I had a right arm too   Hahaha! Half the time I don't know what I mean, either. <-: But yeah, I use my left hand for the neck. I don't know if I could play the other way.  I do use my right hand for some things and could write nearly legibly if  I had to. I have a hard time doing right-handed smilies so generally do left-handed ones. (-:   I have a Taylor acoustic, btw. A few nights ago I dreamt that Mike was on stage in a school auditorium about ready to play his 18-string Taylor. Yes. 18-string Taylor. HAHAHAHAHA. I am really not a very good guitar player.  Nothing to do with handedness, just with motivation, AADD, time, etc. I have played in public a few times (nursing home, Unitarian Church, story hour at the library), but generally am very shy and play when no one is around. -------------- "No such thing as destiny; only choices exist." From:  Moongarden's "Solaris." Back to top

Scatterplot Group: Members Posts: 1981 Joined: Dec. 2007 Posted: June 06 2009, 01:18 Gee whiz, all that fine writing shot to hell.....Nylon? What good is that gonna do ya? Cant use a pick, or at least it's discouraged. Nylon gits are good for some Hackett/Oldfieldish moments but not as versatile as....whatever, have fun....... -------------- We raise our voices in the night Crying to heaven And will our voices be heard Or will they break Like the wind Back to top

raven4x4x Group: Members Posts: 1535 Joined: Jan. 2002 Posted: June 06 2009, 06:54 Well, you need a nylon-stringed guitar to do this. That, and about 10 years of practice   But yes, I agree with Scatterplot that learning guitar on an electric is a good idea. I speak from experience; I got my first guitar about a year ago for my 21st birthday, an Ibanez electric, and I found it much easier to play than my brother's classical guitar. Now I have my guitar, I regret not getting one years ago. I've just been fiddling around with it really, but it's a fantastic way to relax and forget about studying for a few moments. Few things I've done have ever made my happier than mastering Mike's part from Let There Be Light. -------------- Thank-you for helping us help you help us all. Back to top

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