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Topic: Which is the best: 3x coil or 2x coil, 1x humbucke, single coils vs. humbuckers< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
Ostach Offline




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Posted: June 26 2004, 13:09

Hello everyone,

I,m amateur guitar player and I'm interested in buying cheap electric guitar. I want to play many of Mike's solos and I have question: I have choise of buying guitar with 2 single coils and 1 humbucker or 3 single coils. Which is better to play these clear sounds: only coils or combined?

I'm wondering about a Squier Strat, Fat Strat, Bullet and Flame I & II... Can You give an advice abt these uitars and which one better fits Mike's style?

I'll be very happy on any help!


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Korgscrew Offline




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Posted: June 26 2004, 19:06

I think for playing a wide range of Mike's solos, I'd suggest a guitar with a humbucker at the bridge and single coils in other positions, rather than 3 single coils. The humbucker will give a slightly fatter sound, and you'll probably find it has a slightly smoother sound when distorted.
Having the single coils in the other positions will enable you to still get his classic clean Strat sound, for which he normally uses the middle pickup. In addition, you may be able to rewire the guitar to 'coil tap' the humbucker, using just one coil of it instead of two, letting you get single coil sounds from it as well.

Mike has used a lot of different electric guitars in his time though, and really, no one guitar is ever going to get you all of those exact sounds...however, a little imagination and the right playing technique will get you a long way!
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Ostach Offline




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Posted: June 27 2004, 14:44

But do you know the guitars I mantioned? I'm looking for an advice on which guitar I should buy. The specs of these guitars are nearly the same - I simply don't know which one to buy...

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Korgscrew Offline




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Posted: June 27 2004, 17:52

Play them all and get the one you like most!

Really, there won't be a lot of difference between them, they'll all be made in the same factory and probably with some of the same parts, so quality-wise, I'd imagine that they're all about the same.

However, I'm not familiar with the Flame I and II. I remember the Fender Flame from some years ago (a double cutaway, twin humbucker Gibson type guitar, not very popular, though it got reborn as the Robben Ford model after it was discontinued), but I assume you're talking about something else.

The Strat and Fat Strat are pretty much the same, the only difference being the bridge humbucker, which you may find is a good thing to have. The Bullet isn't much different to the Strat (assuming you mean the current Bullet, they've made others called Bullet in the past which were different to the Strat) - the difference is that the Bullet has a hardtail bridge instead of a 'tremolo' (vibrato) bridge. That will make it sound slightly different, but it will also prevent you from doing the aggressive Mike Oldfield tremolo-arm vibrato which he often does now (it's a recent thing really - most of his 70s and 80s work was played on hardtail guitars, so he just did the vibrato with his left hand).

The other difference with the Bullet is that the body is made from plywood rather than the solid 'hardwood' (they don't say which one) which the Strat is made from. Plywood is more dense than solid wood (because of all the glue used in sticking the layers together), and less resonant. People generally think of it as being rather dead sounding, and not a very good thing to make guitar bodies from (it's just used because it's cheap), but its density can add to the guitar's sustain (as can a hardtail bridge).

But, like I say, give them a try if you can, and see which one you like. :)
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BOOsTER Offline




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Posted: June 27 2004, 19:02

my friend advised me to go to the guitar store and ask the people there to play it...dry sound without amp, through amp ...clean and distorded (So you can concentrate on the sound) and see which of them you like...then play you "buy candidates" and get the one you like...

Theres one thing...you must feel comfortable and "in love" with your guitar, because if you don't you will not want to play it... ;)

though I am an amateur myself, hope this helps, cya around and happy playing ;)


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Ostach Offline




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Posted: June 28 2004, 04:02

Thanks for comprehensive info. I'd rather buy the guitar with hard bridge bacause I do vibrato with my left hand already on my classic guitar. And again: thanks for help!

The Flame is the company, maybe less know 'round the world. They produce guitars Bell I&II models. My frinend has one and he says that is a decent guitar.


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BOOsTER Offline




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Posted: July 10 2004, 13:21

Quote (Ostach @ June 28 2004, 10:02)
Thanks for comprehensive info. I'd rather buy the guitar with hard bridge bacause I do vibrato with my left hand already on my classic guitar. And again: thanks for help!

just to comment on this...the vibrato you can do with the whammy bar...is very different to the vibrato which you can do with your left hand:)

at least to me it sounds different:-)


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Ostach Offline




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Posted: July 10 2004, 16:17

Yes, you're right. The vibrato made with the whammy is wider and suonds a bit too wide for me...

I'm still looking for guitar... :p  I found some of them but always something is wrong with them. One is too "hard" for me(if you know what I mean), the sound in other is bad, even if I like guitar it doesn't got the humbucker...


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BOOsTER Offline




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Posted: July 13 2004, 07:44

I know how you feel now...I think of buying a new amp...and still just looking for...comparing and looking at prices...I want something really cheap just for practise...I look at this and that...and never buy any :D

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Ostach Offline




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Posted: Aug. 24 2004, 17:02

Anyone know the Ibanez GRX 140 guitar?

(I know it's slightly offtopic..., sorry!;)


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Korgscrew Offline




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Posted: Aug. 25 2004, 01:08

I'm not sure where it's made (though I'll bet it's either from China, Indonesia or Korea), but I'd imagine you'd fine it very similar in quality to the Squiers. The vibrato bridge is a different design, you might find it slightly better than the older Fender design that the Squiers have, though it's also a kind which has potential for tuning instability. Try one out if you can, you'll soon find out if that's a problem. You can then also decide whether you prefer the feel of the Ibanez body shape over that of the Strat. I've not played the GRX140, but I'd think it's worth a try.
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Ostach Offline




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Posted: Aug. 25 2004, 03:41

I'm looking for cheap guitar for the begonning and it would be nice if it play nice :) When I look on the guitars in that shop I'm afraid I have no choice... :/  GRX140 seems to be the best of cheap guitars there... :P I have seen Yamaha with the fisrt pickup which doesn't work...

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emac Offline




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Posted: Aug. 26 2004, 19:48

I do repairs and setups on guitars and things. And as a general rule I have always found that if there is a Yamaha in a the same price range as some other guitar it is usually better quality and will have better woods. Yamaha hardware is usually of standard size etc, so it is easy to upgrade pickups and stuff.
Ultimatly in cheaper instruments the ones with the least moving parts are the ones that will last. Once they get older the axes with the double overhead locking whammy trembar thing dooers are very nasty to set up, have parts that break and are just great at going out of tune.
When it is set up correctly there is a lot to be said for Leo's original trem design.
When buying a guitar use your ears, listen to it unpluged before you plug it in. this will tell you if the wood is any good. The better ones usually are louder and a little resonant. And try to avoid plywood bodied guitars as they can sound hard and dark (they also tend to fall apart sooner).
All this is only an opinion.

emac.
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Korgscrew Offline




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Posted: Aug. 27 2004, 08:29

I'd agree with what emac says, especially on Yamaha guitars. A non-working pickup should be simple to fix (it's probably just come disconnected) - it might be worth seeing if the shop would be prepared to fix that, if everything else about the guitar is ok. If it's structurally sound and seems like a good quality instrument overall, I'd say it's worth considering.
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EquinoX Offline




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Posted: Oct. 19 2004, 12:04

I would recommend Flame Bell II H+S+S guitar. I own one myself and it is great for playing Mike's stuff. It has good clean sound on single-coils and powerful kick on humbucker. In connection with Roland GP-8 it is able to reproduce most mid-80s and 90s Mike's sounds. It has a reliable tremolo system that stays in tune and finish quality is absolutely superb. The price is also very reasonable - for less than 250 euros you probably won't get a better axe.
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reclspeak Offline




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Posted: Oct. 20 2004, 12:32

A good place to visit for user's reviews of electric guitars is;

Harmony Central

I have two electric guitars, one expensive and one rather cheaper. Like many others I can enthuse about the quality and value of Yamaha guitars.

My "expensive" guitar is a hand-made JJ Retro HB, made by JJ Guitars in Warwickshire, England
JJ Guitars

It has a maple cap body on mahogany, rosewood fingerboard, twin humbuckers with a coil split (which means the humbucker/s are split in half to produce a near single-coil output) and sounds absolutely gorgeous - way better than any Les Paul or PRS I've played. With it I can get the Santana (SG2000 days) tone nailed.

However the JJ is not the best "starter" guitar, due to the expense.

My second guitar is a Yamaha Pacifica 412V (the V is for "anniversary"). This is my travelling and stage guitar. It's way cheaper (£249 in the UK) and unbelievable value for that money. It sounds more like a 'Strat than most modern 'Strats do by a clear mile (you have to spend an awful lot more money to get a better-sounding 'Strat).

It has two single coils (neck and middle) and a humbucker in the bridge, plus a "whammy" bar (vibrato to be more accurate) which I don't use and have had blocked. The finish, weight and tone are wonderful. Having both genuine single-coils and a humbucker is useful. However the next models up - the 612 and 812 have coil-splits on the pickups, which would be useful for some MB tones, and I understand are useful for nailing Dave Gilmour tones.

I've owned a Yamaha guitar now for years - whether electric or a 12-string, and the entire range represent super value-for-money. A 412 will easily beat a cost-twice-as-much-or-more Strat for tone, longevity and manufacturing quality.

When you've chosen a guitar, whatever the model, then you have the difficult decision to make about an amplifier. There are 3 types;

* valve types
* solid-state (transistors)
* digital (integrated circuits, but sometimes incorporate valve technology)

Valve amps are best - they produce the best tones. The problem is that the best tones are achieved when the amp is "over-driven" i.e. cranked-up to the point that it is so loud your neighbours are banging on the walls (if you could hear them) and the police are on their way.

The other problem is that you are limited in the sounds (or tone) from a valve amp (generally). A VOX AC30 will sound like an AC30, and a Fender Tweed will sound like a Fender Tweed, a Marshall like a Marshall, an Orange like a...(you get the idea). So if you decide that suddenly you find you want to play jazz guitar and you own a Marshall, you will have to contemplate getting a more appropriate amp - which means more cost and little space if you don't trade-in/sell your current amp.

I've little experience with solid-state amps, but they apparently provide a little more flexbility. I don't know anyone who owns one though.

Digital amps (or "modelling amps") are becoming increasingly popular. They have the ability to model popular valve amplifiers to varying degrees of success. However they can sometimes sound either inaccurate, or lacking in the "warmth" of a valve amp. One huge advantage is that if the amp model is accurate, the digital amp doesn't need to be over-driven to achieve the tone, so yours ears are saved, and your neighbours don't call the police.

A number of companies sell "modelling amps", notably Line 6, Vox (aka Korg) Fender and Roland. I have one, a Vox Valvetronix 60-watt model, and I've been very pleased with it. It comes with a bucket-full of excellent effects (you should buy an add-on pedal-board) modulations, delay's and resonance capabilities, and is simple to use. The AC30 emulation (my favourite valve amp) is perfect at any volume (and I've not had to spend £900 to afford an AC30!;)  At the entry level, the Valvetronix range extends to 15 & 30 watt models, whilst Line 6 sell a popular modelling amp called Spider.

In the end, getting access to a flexible guitar type (i.e humbuckers and single-coils) an amp that doesn't limit you to just a few tones, and a hoot-load of effects should enable you to achieve a least a passable impression of a few of MO's tones. However you must remember that professional guitarists like MO have access to a range of tools and instruments that most fans and "weekend-warrior" guitarists have no chance of matching. In my experience two guitarists in the world are extremely difficult to match exactly for tone and technique - they are Mike Oldfield, and Steve Hackett.
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emac Offline




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Posted: Oct. 22 2004, 00:45

I aggree about modeling amps. I tried out the Line6 flextone the other day and I'm starting to question the need for my other amps. Digital amps seem to sound damn good.
But my head and heart are in two different places, Heres the problem:
Without limitations in your equipment it may (not will) be harder to develop your own sound, eg without underpowered amps Billy Gibbons would have not developed his Harmonic pick squeal sound, he was just trying to get the max out of a min amp.
And without a beat up telecaster and a really dodgy fuzzbox Mike himself would probably sound quite different now!
Usually the gear you have when you are trying to get your act together will affect your playing long after it is gone and you have moved to bigger and better!
So while I love the line6 stuff........well you know.
Yes I know that we are creaping off subject here.
Eden.
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16 replies since June 26 2004, 13:09 < Next Oldest | Next Newest >

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