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Topic: Why Isn't Mike Played in the US?< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
Ecco Offline




Group: Musicians
Posts: 229
Joined: Nov. 2002
Posted: April 29 2005, 20:02

"" The U.S. Justice Department is looking at whether Clear Channel violated laws by limiting radio airtime of artists who don't do business with its concert arm."  

source: Chicago Tribune
(see link below for full April 30th article)



Why do you think MO stuff isn't played in the US anymore? Seems after Earth Moving, Mike's stuff dwindled off the radio air waves. Actually, after EM, a lot of other prog-rock and classical music was weeded out of radio.
Could the control of the various Media by a handful of giant Corporations have anything to do with it?



Here is a good place to do some research:
Media Reform

For a more balanced  approach I find it is best to use Google's News search engine to do research.
It's also more up to date. For instance, this April 30th article, from the Chicago Tribune, mentions how the US Justice Department is investigating Clear Channel, while also giving Clear Channel spokespeople a chance to voice their own opinions.

Tribune link may give you a subscibtion only block. Here is the Denver Post's link:
Denvor


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hiawatha Offline




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Posted: April 30 2005, 16:49

Quote (Ecco @ April 29 2005, 20:02)
Could the control of the various Media by a handful of giant Corporations have anything to do with it?

It doesn't because such control does not exist. Name a market where the media is controlled by these 5 companies, if you can. I showed elsewhere that the media is in reality controlled by thousands of corporations and organizations.

The link you provided cooks facts. The site is basically one run by extremists who want the government to control all media and expression (rather than it being left to the people). Their extremism is underlined by their listing fringe pro-censorship groups such as "FAIR" as a "watchdog".  They also link to and support many sites that are proposing that the government take over the airwaves and tightly control the content (the Nazi Germany/Soviet Russia model). There is one, Media Access, that is blatantly racist and proposes that media access be granted based on skin color. If you want to do research, don't do it at web sites that are long on opinion and short on fact. Avoid websites like the one you linked to that is a baseless fringe rant.

Besides, the only two Oldfield songs I ever heard on the radio (other than as bumper music for various talk radio stations such as NPR) were the Exorcist theme and someone else's rendition of "Family Man". There is no evidence of any control conspiracies on media, let alone any that censored Oldfield off the air when he was not really present in the first place.

The idea that the Bildeburgers, just 5 companies, or the Elders of Zion control the media is way out on the fringe. The further idea that they somehow have set out to ban Mike from the airwaves is beyond the fringe. The real reason for a lack of Oldfield music is indifference by the vast majority of the population.

Yes, a lot of people love Britney Spears. The reasons have to do with their musical taste, rather than a media control conspiracy. The peculiar tastes of the USA public have also apparently kept us free of Kylie Minogue. I understand that this is a good thing.

This reminds me of the "Noam Chomsky fallacy". This particular well-spoken linguist has trouble dealing with the fact that his sometimes-genocidal Stalinist views are extremely unpopular, so for years he has been writing books and papers concocting fictional brainwashing cabals to somehow explain how he is right and 99% of everyone else is wrong.

I admit I love music that happens to be rather unpopular. I am comfortable with this fact. I feel no need to appeal to imaginary conspiracies which have somehow crushed the music I love.


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"In the land of the Dacotahs,
Where the Falls of Minnehaha
Flash and gleam among the oak-trees,
Laugh and leap into the valley."
- Song of Hiawatha
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Ecco Offline




Group: Musicians
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Posted: April 30 2005, 18:24

[quote=hiawatha,April 30 2005, 16:49][/quote]
Quote
They also link to and support many sites that are proposing that the government take over the airwaves and tightly control the content (the Nazi Germany/Soviet Russia model). There is one, Media Access, that is blatantly racist and proposes that media access be granted based on skin color.


What ARE you talking about? No one here but you is talking about conspiracies and political agendas. Facts are facts and the big fact of the world is that everything runs on money. You can talk agendas and conspiracies until you're blue (or red, for you [ha]) in the face, we're talking about profit margins and monopolies.

Not sure where you are in the US, but Tony has heard the entire Wind Chimes from Islands, side one of Hergest Ridge and side one of Tubular Bells all on major New York city rock stations--including live interviews with Mike on said stations.

According to Godwins law, the first person in an internet forum who begins making comparisons to Nazis and such autmatically loses the arguement. I guess it is common.


Julie and Tony.


Godwins Law


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hiawatha Offline




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Posted: April 30 2005, 19:48

Quote (Ecco @ April 30 2005, 18:24)
What ARE you talking about? No one here but you is talking about conspiracies and political agendas.
...face, we're talking about profit margins and monopolies.....
...side one of Hergest Ridge and side one of Tubular Bells all on major New York city rock stations--including live interviews with Mike on said stations.

In the thread where this was really off-topic. you referred to an agenda, which you left secret.

Monopolies.... like the Clear Channel company owning 6% of stations instead of 96%?

New York City.... a place with scads of stations not owned by CC.

So I'm "red" because I strongly oppose media control and censorship, and recognize that a company that only owns 6% of radio stations is not monopolizing radio.


--------------
"In the land of the Dacotahs,
Where the Falls of Minnehaha
Flash and gleam among the oak-trees,
Laugh and leap into the valley."
- Song of Hiawatha
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Ecco Offline




Group: Musicians
Posts: 229
Joined: Nov. 2002
Posted: April 30 2005, 20:22

Quote
In the thread where this was really off-topic. you referred to an agenda, which you left secret.


It's impossible to refer to something and keep it secret at the same time. Neither of us knows what you are referring to.

Quote
Monopolies.... like the Clear Channel company owning 6% of stations instead of 96%?


Who said CC owns 96% of anything? Read the stats yourself. This is from Buisiness Week--hardly an anti-corperate publication: Business Week Article

Quote
New York City.... a place with scads of stations not owned by CC.


Maybe that's why Mike's stuff was played there? Ya think?

Quote
So I'm "red" because I strongly oppose media control and censorship, and recognize that a company that only owns 6% of radio stations is not monopolizing radio.


And we're aligned with Noam Chomsky and Stalin because we agree with you; that no one government or Corporation should own the media? We felt that you're 'red' based on our observations that when faced with facts, Right Extremists resort to innuendo and character assassination. You'd be better off not lending your personal opinion to facts just because you don't like them.

Julie and Tony.


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hiawatha Offline




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Posted: April 30 2005, 21:09

Agenda: You referred to the mythical 5 companies controlling everything having an agenda. You never said what it the agenda was. You said something like "we both know what it is". My only guess is that you assert that these companies have an agenda to crush Mike Oldfield. Such an agenda could backfire: when Clear Channel refused to play the Dixie Chicks, they only got more popular.

Clear Channel: "Who said CC owns 96% of anything? Read the stats yourself." I did. 1,200 stations out of 20,000 total. That's a pretty small share. They do have a huge chunk of ticket sales, but not radio stations. That is a problem, I agree, because unlike with radio stations, CC has huge clout here. The ticket sales monopoly by Clear Channel does not hurt Mike Oldfield, because (unfortunately), he does not tour here.

"Red": If you had used as your source a right-wing media rant site (Limbaugh/etc, or AIM), I would have been just as critical of using editorial opinions as a source for fact.

Concerning Mike: Why do you think that the scads of stations that are not Clear Channel and do not play Mike? I really do not know for sure, but strongly suspect that it is audience rejection. Like or or not, America loves country, rap, and hip-hop.

"Faced with Facts": I do recall a claim that 5 media companies controlled everything, which I refuted by counting companies and showing how media diversity and the # of companies involved has increased (not decreased). I've taken care to count the stations involved in the CC discussion. Do you have a market to show where Clear Channel dominates? I've checked several at random (and a few big ones like NYC) and this company dominates none.

Also, I mentioned not hearing Mike on radio really since the Exorcist theme. I probably could mention that i have heard/seen his music on television. Ironically, Oldfield was played by Viacom cable network stations. Viacom is one of those 5 companies that some falsely claim control everything. (now under the Paramount name).

Just about all of the radio stations I listen to (or can POSSIBLY listen to, with the exception of distant AM stations at night) are owned by small companies (and no CC anywhere near). I've never heard any of my local stations play Oldfield except in small snippets as "bumper music"...and this is over decades. This shows how useless it is to explain his absense from the airwaves by the machinations of a corporate cabal. I basically got hooked on Oldfield from when "Tubular Bells" came out, and I only found out the new ones by checking record stores frequently. Radio was never any help to me.

As for opinion, the numbers showing CC's small share and the many companies other than the "big 5" are not matters of opinion.


--------------
"In the land of the Dacotahs,
Where the Falls of Minnehaha
Flash and gleam among the oak-trees,
Laugh and leap into the valley."
- Song of Hiawatha
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Ecco Offline




Group: Musicians
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Joined: Nov. 2002
Posted: May 01 2005, 00:25

This thread has lost its purpose. We both thought more people would be interested in it; and they probably WERE, but it's become tit-for-tat between us. You have your statistics, we have ours and no matter what we post, you keep coming back with the same 'refute'.

It would be nice to hear Mike and other progressives on the radio once again, though it doesn't personally affect us, really. We are more concerned with equality, and thankfully, the Internet came about just in the nick of time. A level playing field for all and a great democratic medium.

Julie and Tony. :cool:


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hiawatha Offline




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Posted: May 01 2005, 08:11

By and large, yes. Especially the last part you wrote.

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"In the land of the Dacotahs,
Where the Falls of Minnehaha
Flash and gleam among the oak-trees,
Laugh and leap into the valley."
- Song of Hiawatha
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hiawatha Offline




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Posted: May 06 2005, 10:20

Ecco, just wondering. Was the station (or stations) that used to play Oldfield in NYC bought out by one of these giant national media conglomerates like Clear Channel?

--------------
"In the land of the Dacotahs,
Where the Falls of Minnehaha
Flash and gleam among the oak-trees,
Laugh and leap into the valley."
- Song of Hiawatha
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DistantJ Offline




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Posted: July 12 2005, 05:43

Why is'nt Mike played in the US? Because the US nowadays only plays commercialist recycled gangsta rap junk.
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